S3 Ep115 Mark Ormrod: Rebuilding From Zero

Mark Ormrod knelt on an IED on Christmas Eve, 2007. Two legs gone above the knee. One arm gone above the elbow. The UK's first triple amputee to survive Afghanistan.

This isn't that story. Not really. It's what came after.

Mark talks about the Royal Marine recruiting line he heard as a teenager "it's a mindset." He didn't understand what that actually meant until rehab. Prosthetics. A blank sheet. Nothing left to fall back on.

He also talks about the year before that. Homeless, nearly jailed, working nightclub doors, living off cash in an envelope. Less than twelve months after being an elite commando. He got out of it by remembering who he already knew he was.

Mark's chasing something bigger now a black belt, a business, "the ultimate version of himself." But even he admits he doesn't fully know what that means yet. Neither do most of us.

This one's about mindset, humility, and the slow, unfinished work of figuring out what you actually need.

 If you care about resilience, high performance, mindset coaching, military leadership lessons, and navigating major life change, this one will stay with you. 

Subscribe, share it with someone who needs a reset, and leave us a review with your biggest takeaway.

Follow Mark on his Instagram account or find out more about him via his website. 

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Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Welcome to Fortune Resilience. Real conversations for high performance facing transition. I'm Erin Hill. And join me as I talk with people about challenge change and the adversity they faced in life, so we can live from their experiences, insights, and stories. How do I pronounce your second name by the way, Mark? Ormrod. Ormrod. Today on Forge of Resilience, I'm joined by Mark Ormrod. Mark is a former Royal Marine Commando who's an author, speaker, entrepreneur, and trustee of Reorg. In 2007, while serving in Afghanistan, Mark suffered life-changing injuries and became the UK's first triple amputee to survive the conflict. But this conversation isn't just about what happened to Mark. It's about what he's built against. Today his work focuses on resilience, mindset, ownership, and helping people move forward when life changes completely. He speaks openly about identity, transition, fatherhood, and performance, and the stand that helps us rebuild when life, when the old life no longer fits. Mark, welcome to the show, mate. Thank you for having me, dude. Appreciate it. No, it's my pleasure. Between technical glitches, um, elbows being used to type, or elbows and go there, yeah. And just life, mate. Yeah, I appreciate you

Why He Joined The Military

SPEAKER_04 1:24

being here. Mark, for for for those of us that don't know, give us a little bit of a flavor of your story, mate.

SPEAKER_03 1:33

Um it's a complex, long, ever-evolving story. But uh, I guess if I was gonna start from the beginning, um, I knew I went and joined the military when I was 15. I live in Plymouth, in Devon, big military city. Uh, all my friends that I was growing up with were older than I was, and they had already left school and gone on their own individual paths, and many of those paths led them to the military, I think, in uh every every branch of the military. Now, when I was coming up towards the end of school, despite being told by teachers and family and parents that I should start thinking about what I wanted to do. Um, you know, if I did well, if I didn't do well, like most 15-year-olds, I ignored them and just played computer games and hang around in the streets. And then one day I kind of was walking down the school corridor and had this moment where I realized, guess what? Maybe I should start thinking about what I want to do when I finish school. So I had a look around uh at what friends were doing, those friends that were older than me. I had a think about my interests, hobbies, passions, and those kind of things. This is in 1999, so the internet had only just been invented, so information wasn't as widely available or as overwhelmingly available as it is now. But I remember looking at my friends in the military, thinking to myself, that kind of looks like a good crack. You know, I had from probably 1994, maybe 1995, to the current time, I had taught myself fitness because the internet didn't exist. Um, I'd bought magazines, trained in the school gym, was a martial artist competing in Muta and kickboxing. So I wanted to do something that built on that and was physical. They seemed to come home on leave periods uh and have what to me back then was a lot of money. They always had new cars, they're always talking to me about, you know, we went on this six-mile run and then we shot machine guns and we drove tanks in Canada and Germany and wherever they were in the world. And I'm like, you know, that kind of sounds cool. And because I grew up in the 80s and 90s as well, you know, we had Arnie and Stallone and you know, all those boys, action movie stars. I thought, you know what? I'm gonna give that a crack. And so my mate John took me down to the Army Career Centre, he was in this the 2nd Tank Regiment in Germany, got some paperwork to join the army, took it home. I had to get my parents to sign it because I was only 15. And that was the moment that my dad told me I had an uncle who was a Royal Marine. Now he had joined the Royal Marines as a Marine at the bottom of the ladder, did a full 22-year career and left as a captain. And I didn't even know who the Royal Marines were, which is you know bizarre considering their headquarters were in Plymouth, 4-2 commanders in Plymouth. I live in Plymouth, was born, raised, and educated in Plymouth. I had no idea who they were. But I went and had a chat with him. I went back to the career centre the following week after talking with him, and this is when they had VHS cassettes and TV video combinations, and the recruiting guy there, I think he was a W02, if I remember rightly. He put the VHS cassette in, the recruiting video, and I watched it and it just blew me away. I'd not seen anything from any of the branches of the military that tried persuading me to join them that was quite like this, you know, and it literally looked like the the REs and the Stallones from the action movies, but in real life, so I was like, damn, I want to give that a shot. Now, my uncle, when I spoke to him, um made it very clear to me what differentiates the Royal Marines from any other branch of the military and the kind of attrition rate and how difficult it is. And you know, I think at the time when I was uh going for it, the the recruiting slogan was it's a mindset, something like that. I can't remember exactly what it was. And he had told me that that is you know pretty much bang on. You can be you've got to be able to be cold, wet, tired, hungry, sleep-deprived, food-deprived, miserable, and and laugh about it. You don't just have to be fit. But once I watched that video, I was like, right, I'm locked in. This is this is all I want to do. And I went back to school, I got all 10 GCSEs, nine of them were A to C's, one was a D. So I could have gone on to college and you know, potentially university, but none of that interested me. Like, no, I'm not a very academic by my nature. Um and I was locked in. So I just I did the exams, uh, waited for a bit, eventually got a letter inviting me to do the three-day potential Royal Marine course. Was fortunate enough to pass that without any injury or any failure, and then went home with a training program and a kit list, and was just told follow this training programme, buy this kit, and then wait for another letter. And that letter will then invite you to start Royal Marine Recruit Training. That I don't know when the letter came, I can't remember exactly, but I was invited to start recruit training in February in 2001. I was 17 years old at the time, and for for that time between school and joining the military, I was working in in McDonald's in Plymouth. There was a new one that had been built on a brand new ledger complex. And if you worked on that complex, you got to use the gym for like £20 a month, otherwise, it was like £5 a session, £20 a month, £180 a year, all these different fees. So I was like, well, that works out. I can earn a bit of money, train in the lead up, um, and then ditch that job when I need to, and then join the military. So that's what I did. And in February 2001, I started as one of 64 members of 804 troop um on this on this journey with no real idea of what was ahead of me, just knowing that I was scared straight, completely out of my depth, overwhelmed, terrified, and pretty much useless at everything. And that was my MO, really, for the for the Holy Royal News training. Used average at everything, dragged through by the lads, scraped through most things by the skin of my teeth, didn't enjoy most of it, wanted to go home nearly every day, but just add that I'm gonna just call it stupidity, uh, to just get up every day and keep putting one foot in front of the other, and then eventually you do that long enough, and guess what? 30 weeks go by, the leave periods go by, and before you know it, you're one of 16 people out of 64 that started, um, with a green beret thrust in your hand after a after a 30-mile bimble across Dartmoor. Um and that was the start of my my military career, really. Um yeah, great childhood, active out there, great start to the military, like a I guess you could call it like a clean sheet, you know, getting through

Recruit Training And The Mindset Test

SPEAKER_03 9:20

in a wanna. I was 18 when I passed out, and I passed out about eight weeks after 9-11. It was November 2001. So, although I had no clue about the world, geopolitics, war, any of that stuff, you know, when when me and the lads saw 9-11 happen, we we kind of knew that you know, training is a game, really, isn't it? It's they're trying to break you, you know, you learn some cool stuff, but it's just designed to fuck you about and to make you think that you're invincible. And it's pretty terrifying, really, when you think, actually, now you're gonna have to do this for real. You know, there's no more blank rounds, no more controlled environment with a DS running around, making sure everyone's safe. You know, you might have to go out and do this job for real now. And as an 18-year-old, I didn't know how I felt about that. It was it was pretty confusing. But I remember looking round uh on camp when when we saw 9-11 happen, and I kind of looked at all the rest of the lads and I was like, right, I'm gonna see how they're acting, and I'll just copy them because I don't know what I'm supposed to do. And they all kind of all the Faust Bravado came out, I think, and everyone's like, so I was like, yeah, let's go. Not really having any idea what the future held. Um, but yeah, it kind of it kind of panned out how I thought it might, um, given what had happened. So 2002, uh, straight out of training, I was uh trained to go on Omchikana in Afghanistan. I didn't end up going, loads of us didn't end up going. I I think it became more of an SF kind of like recce thing. I don't know that many people actually deployed on Jacana in the end. And again, I didn't know how to feel about that. You you go through this pre-deployment training, you hype yourself up mentally, you get yourself ready, and then they they pull it last minute. And then what I ended up actually doing was being a glorified taxi driver from Stonehouse Barracks in Plymouth to South Sarney and Bryce Norton, picking up blokes that had deployed, bringing them home, and then taking them back, and then having to listen to their stories and their tales of what they've been doing for the weeks that they've been in theatre, which you know, as a as a young sprog, it was just odd, you know. I'm like, why are they doing all this? What surely I should be out there, and then I'm you know, to myself in my head, I'm like, shut up, sprog, just do what you're told, like you're not good enough yet. Um,

Early Tours And Civilian Freefall

SPEAKER_03 12:00

and then that whole thing kind of rolled past. 2003 came around. Uh I turned 19 at that point, and then was told we would deploy into Iraq on Telic 1. So I went through a pre-deployment training cycle for that. Uh, this time I did deploy uh on Talek One. I was involved in that initial push over the Kuwait-Iraqi border uh into a place called Azerbaijan Naval Base. Uh I was at Stonehouse, so 30 commander at the time, HQ. Uh 4-2, I think, went up to the palace, and I think it was 40 went to like the oil fields and all that stuff. But didn't see a thing in three and a half months, really. I didn't fire around, didn't get involved in anything. I even I volunteered to be QRF for an army medical regiment because I thought if I'm going to see anything, it's going to be with the ambulances, you know, dealing with casualties and that kind of thing. But no, nothing. Uh came back from that tour. Was a little bit deflated, you know, because I built up in my mind a picture of what combat was like. Didn't experience that, but then just settled back into life, you know, did a couple of Norway deployments, uh, boxed for the Marines. It came upon orders about boxing. I thought, well, uh, you know, I've competed in kickboxing before and mutai, just be a bit of fizz in the morning, and then I get the rest of the day off. It was eight hours a day, six weeks, and I'm like, no. I thought I was just gonna do a bit like two hours in the morning and have the rest of the day off. So did that for a bit, and then I actually left in 2006. Um was it 2006? Yeah, 2006 when my daughter was born. Yeah, my eldest daughter was born, left, failed miserably as a civilian, um ended up homeless, uh, nearly went to jail. Uh was working as a nightclub dormer to try and earn some cash. I I did I shut up the South Africa and retrained as a bodyguard for six weeks, couldn't get any work in the industry, um, not for lack of it, I think just because I was 21, 22, didn't know anybody, um, didn't know anyone in that world who could help me. So what I ended up doing due to having no money, um, being constantly in trouble, and having no prospects of work as a as a CP operative, I rejoined the military in 2007 after about 11 and a half months as a Civi. Because I'd only been a Civi for 11 and a half months, I didn't have to redo the whole of training, just a BFT, CFT, APWT, and some MBC drills, I think that was it. And a weapons handling test, obviously. Um, and then I was back in rig, uh, early 2007. They gave me the choice, you can go to, they said you can go to Limpston um or a 40 commando. 40 commando were next on the rotation to go to Afghan. So I thought, well, I missed it the first time around. I've done Iraq, I'll go to 40, see what Afghan's like, joined the unit, did what I do best, which is keep my mouth shut,

Back To Afghan And Combat Reality

SPEAKER_03 15:20

you know, gradually work my way in to the to the the troop, be the grey man, don't make too much commotion, do what I'm told. And then on the 7th of September 2007, uh deployed for Op Herrick 7, um, for what I thought was gonna be a sixth-month tour duty. Yeah, it wasn't not through any fault of my own. Well, in fact, it was completely free of fault of my own, but not through any choice of my own. Um that that tour was was cut in half due to me standing on an improvised explosive device. Now the first thing I'll say is this was what I had built this was the picture that I built up in my mind of of what war was like and what combat was like. It was so different to Iraq. Um any minute of any hour of any day, you could get shot at, rocketed, mortared. You know, I was having firefights at like two o'clock in the morning in my underwear, getting crashed out of my pit when we would come under attack. Uh, you'd be out on foot patrols, and you know, bullets just start winging your way. You've always, you know, you know, it's like you just you're you're constantly in a heightened state of fight and flight everywhere you go. Every time you walk out a compound door, you're a sniper's wet dream. Um so you just live in this like constant elevated state, um which you kind of get used to bizarrely. Um but it's also I think necessary for the environment.

The IED And A Textbook Evacuation

SPEAKER_03 17:18

Now on Christmas Eve 2007, uh we were tasked with going out on uh another routine foot patrol, very, very basic one, in its simplest form. Um, what they wanted us to do was to leave the rear entrance of camp in two sections, one go north, one go south, patrol the immediate perimeter of camp, uh pushing no one in 300 metres from the perimeter wall, and then meet up, secure the location, and go back in the front entrance. So it's big we've been confined to camp for a couple of days due to lack of manpower. We had we had the responsibility of three sentry boxes, and a couple lads got injured, just silly injuries, like one fell off a truck and broke his leg, one had DMV, so we couldn't mount patrols. So as soon as we had some manpower, we went out on a patrol, but it wasn't we didn't have an objective or a mission effectively. It was just get out there, we know we're being watched, show them that we're out there doing our job still, so they don't look at any, they don't look at it as an opportunity to start raining mortars down on our position. Now, at the end of that patrol, um, as we were about to go back into camp, my section were on some high ground, so we were tasked to give an overwatch to the other group of men that we left with earlier in the day. And I was, I think I was the last man to take a fire position. I was second in command of the section, so um, I was definitely last man of my half of the section, but potentially the whole section. So everyone was in their fire positions, giving overwatch, ready, and then as I went to get onto my stomach to get into my fire position, I knelt on and detonated uh an improvised explosive device.

SPEAKER_00 19:10

That improvised explosive device instantly removed both my legs above the knee and my right arm above the elbow.

SPEAKER_03 19:23

Now anyone listen to this, I I completely get where you'd be coming from if you thought because this is how I thought, right, and this is what all the lads we talked about this a lot. We all said you gotta be pretty dumb if you stand on an ID. Because despite the terrain being sandy and dusty and and dirty, it wasn't like the ground sign would be there, right? But where we were taking where we were taking cover and we had gone firm was in like a shallow bowl in the ground, and so where it had been raining uh from time to time, I think it had smoothed out any ground sign of any digging. So there there was no you couldn't see anything, you know, there was no there was no indication that anything had been buried there. So I knelt on this thing, it exploded, took off both my legs above the knee, right arm above the elbow. This chaotic but highly, highly professional casualty evacuation then ensued with everyone performing their individual responsibilities to the highest possible standard. I had a 19-year-old on his stomach with a bayonet, prodding the ground, clearing a safe route left and right for when the medic got to me. One guy giving a nine-liner on the radio straight back to HQ, letting them know the state I was in to call in the Kazivak. I had guys coordinating around defence, I had guys talking to me, one guy talking to me to keep me conscious because of the massive blood loss I was experiencing, and I was kind of flipping in and out of consciousness, and they all did what they were pre-assigned to do absolutely perfectly. Now I don't know if I could have done that, and I don't know if I could have overrid every emotion I have as a human to want to go in and run and help my friend or to freeze because of fear. I I don't know if I could have, but they did like unbelievably well. And it's just a testament to the to the kind of men that they were, that they are, and because of that, the medic, when he got to me, got to me very, very quickly, gave me some pain relief, tourniquet both my legs, asked me to tourniquate my tourniquet my right arm, and then Scooped up what was left of my right leg and my right arm onto my belly, put me on a stretcher, he took me out of the minefield, and I don't know how he did this because we were working with some American special forces guys when we're out there, and one of their jobs was to write reports and clear these minefields when there was an incident. And I read the report, and so we're on high ground, and this like shallow bow that we were in initially was now 12 feet deep by 15 feet around with six other IEDs in it. I have no clue how he got me out of a 15-foot crater down off the high ground because of the terrain was so like loose and awful. But then get me into a vehicle, and then the vehicle started driving, and you know, these are not tarmac roads, they're potholes are huge. So I'm getting thrown around in the back of this thing. Then we start climbing up the incline to go back into camp, and the vehicle's sliding everywhere under the loose terrain, and I think we hit a pothole, and the medic fell out the back, and then I fell out the back, and then a driver grabbed me by my femur bone and held me in the vehicle, like kind of like upside down, hanging out the back of this thing. Um he left the medic because that the other section, the guys that we were given overwatch for, were at the bottom of the incline, so he was safe, and then they drove me back to camp, uh, sorry, yeah, back through camp to the HLS. And the last thing that I can remember is the Chinook coming down to land, the sandstorm that the propellers uh create, and then the heat from the exhaust kind of beating down on me, and all these, you know, I remember hearing all these stones and pebbles say ping, ping, ping, ping, ping off the vehicle. Then I I passed out, um, blacked out, and and later found out after speaking to the medical team that they declared me clinically dead uh on the scene. So yeah, that's a that's a brief summary of the early part of my career, the bit that went okay. Um that was the first couple years. Um, I squeezed a lot in. I felt quite fortunate um prior to getting blown up that I'd managed to fit in, you know, training, a couple Norways, exercises in America with Allied forces, the boxing squad for the core championships, the navy championships, um, you know, all the courses that you can squeeze in. And in the first like four or five years, it was I was pretty happy with that. And then this tour, you know, I was kind of happy with that for the for the first half of it, getting some real good leadership experience, volunteering for everything that I could. My plan when I came back was to really try and push for promotion, um, see if I can get on a junior command course, something like that, and then really take control of my career because I didn't do that in the beginning. I just did what a lot of guys do, which is out drinking and fighting and being a clown. Um, so I wanted to be a bit more of a grown-up, and then unfortunately uh was injured, came home, and then started the recovery process.

SPEAKER_04 25:28

Yeah, you've you've there's a lot there, Mark. Not just from yeah, the the story, but there's loads of little uh bits I'd like to follow. But I'm I'm yeah, I think I'll go with what comes up now, which is you've obviously told your story a lot of times, and I I'm curious what

Identity After Injury And Rehab Drive

SPEAKER_04 25:45

comes up for you as you tell it again now in this moment.

SPEAKER_03 25:51

Shall I be perfectly honest with you? 100% mate, I'm bored to tears of telling my story.

SPEAKER_04 25:57

Yeah, I swear to God. I love it. I was gonna ask, are you bored of it? But I'm glad you answered that. So if if if we move on then from that, in terms of of coming back and rebuilding, what's what's something I mean you've had you it's an extreme case that you've come from, but what's something you would um like people want to understand or that people least understand about having to start again in terms of what life looks like with only one of them in this case so I think I think there's two things first of all, if you go back to what we said about what the Royal Marine recruiting slogan was when I was going through training, it's a mindset like there's not much in life that can prove to you how true that is unless you go through something like this.

SPEAKER_03 27:28

Now I get going through Royal Marines training, yes, it is a mindset, you know as well as anyone how many people fail it and drop out, but it's a different world, you know. You get three limbs ripped off, and you're like, right, okay, let me see how this mindset thing works now, then because this is different. And do you know when when that really clicked for me? When I said just now that I used to I messed around a lot in the first couple years of my career, like most lads do, I got charged about three times. And there was one time I was getting charged by the RSM, his name was Baz Dor. He was an RSM A30 commando, and I was in his office, and he his pet his pet hate was when lads cut the lining out of their beret, and I'd cut mine out because it shaped better. And he told me to take it off, he looked at it, pinned it to his board, and he said, Right, get into town, get another one, get back to me, go. So I sprinted into town, came back with this massive, like Frank Spencer style beret on my head, and he kept my lid. Now, when I was in hospital, he had been promoted to the core RSM, and he came to visit me with the Commandant General, and he brought me a lid, and he said, I remember taking this off you back in 2002, and I don't know what it was, I do know what it was that it flicked the switch at me because I was like, We get told that being a Royal Marines in mindset, we get told that it's this unique family that you join, and now I've got this guy who's reached the pinnacle of his career, who's a legend throughout the court, who's done everything you can ever think of doing, and he remembers a scroke bag like me, and he probably had loads of scroke bags like me in front of him, and he remembered me and he brought me my lid, and that really hit me, and I was like, wow! And I'd never worked in a tri-service environment before. I'd been on a couple courses and and been in that kind of environment, never worked in it before, right? So, rehab I knew was going to be tri-service, and after they left, I'm like, do you know what? This whole mindset thing that everyone talks about, it's it's a nice marketing slogan, and it might you know make you feel good for a second, but I want to show people what this is actually all about and what being a Royal Marine is about. And so when I go to rehab, as the most severely injured bloke there, who everyone's probably gonna wrap in cotton wall and feel sorry for, I'm gonna be like, I'm gonna show them like no, no, no, like this is not how we operate, we operate differently. Give me the prosthetics, give me the goal, give me the target, the mission, the objective, and then just get out of the way. And and that was from that visit, that was my mindset, and it really solidified for me how how your mindset is as important, if not more important, than your skill set or your your physical ability or anything like that. Now the second thing is I I think there's always an opportunity in in every challenge and in every adversity, and for me it was it was an opportunity to rebuild myself from the ground up, and that's what I took it as. You know, I I it wasn't easy for me to accept that my career was over, but you've got to be a grown-up about it, right? And you know that it is can't deploy, can't get promoted, you've only got one arm. I knew they were gonna try and you know, give me some sort of clerical job at some point if I wanted it, which is what happened, but I just thought, well, we've got an opportunity here to rebuild. Do you know what I mean? And I tried to take some of the positives from it. There weren't many, you know, but I tried to take them. And I said, okay, I've got three limbs missing, but that's it. And what I mean by that is I had no traumatic brain injury, no post-traumatic stress disorder. I didn't have shrapnel rip from my body and tear my intestines up. I don't have colostomy bags, I don't have any of that stuff. What you see is what you get. Three missing limbs. It's all physical for me, no other complications. And that was something to be grateful for. So I thought, okay, we can rebuild from here. I knew I was going to get really good care, I knew I was gonna get really good prosthetics, and I was gonna get taken care of. So my kind of whole focus now, what do I want my life to be after this? I'll always be a Royal Marine, you know, like you probably. There's there's my lid there on the show. I'm gonna pass that photo. No one can ever take that away from us. What we aren't, but we can't dine out on it forever, even though I do. I guess the speaker, but you gotta move on, you've got to look at these opportunities where everything gets burnt down to the ground to rebuild, to solidify that foundation and just build back up with something new, a new purpose, new direction. And so that's what I wanted to do, you know, get to rehab, get better, and then figure something else out.

SPEAKER_04 32:18

To to take you back to the the beginning of how you started today in in and like talking about training and being overwhelmed and being you didn't say this, but gash at everything, me too. And I think most of us feel like that. Um, and you said it was just stupidity because you kept showing up one day and you wanted to go home every day, yeah. Me too. And I and I would 100% say that's a mindset thing. That's not stupidity, mate. Um, you're humble, I get that, and it's interesting that that the core RSM whose name I forget now, he did Baz, he saw you as a lot of people do, and as I do, not for what you've done or happened, it's for who you're being. Who you are, and that's yeah, that comes down to a mindset thing.

SPEAKER_03 33:08

Yeah, one of the greatest. I mean, the the core and the military, they teach you a lot of great things, like values, and you know, one of the the greatest things, I think I'm 42 now, and I just think humility is like a superpower. That's what I don't care. I don't care admitting that I struggled at things and I was ashamed, you know, overwhelmed with things. I don't care. I couldn't care less if anyone laughed about it, if they made fun of me. I'm like, I don't care. I'm I'm being honest with you, I'm struggling with this right now. It sucks. I suck, I'm I'm gash. Help me. Do you know what I mean? I'm um I'll ask for help. I don't understand why other people don't. They want to try and you know, bash through on their own and figure things out. I'm like, look, the only thing that matters to me is the objective, and that was to get a green beret. Now, I'll I'll do it in any way that I can as long as it's honest. I'm not gonna cheat or break the law or anything like that. But if I need help, I'm gonna ask for help. If I suck at something, I'll tell you I suck at it. You know, I suck at lots of suck at nearly everything. I'm just absolutely average at everything.

SPEAKER_04 34:16

Yeah, yeah, but that doesn't matter though, as you allude to, because it's this the it's the it's the person behind it, you know, it's not the thing. That's that's what comes up for me. Yeah, wait, um in terms of of your difficult spell between becoming homeless and almost going to jail, what what do you think it was that you tapped in to turn it around for yourself?

SPEAKER_03 34:38

I think it was a moment of reflection, you know. I was I so I got in a bit of trouble with the police, and and I mean this, uh that it was not my fault. Like it was just a strange sequence of events, and I I was looking at doing a little bit of prison time, um, and I sat on the end of my bed at about three o'clock in the morning after a shift on a nightclub, and just

Humility Reflection And Asking For Help

SPEAKER_03 35:06

I was like, what's what am I doing here? Like I've just graduated from a sofa to renting a room. I worked this job and I love the job because I love the lads that I work with, but I'm always getting spat at and punched in the face and in trouble. I didn't see my daughter at the time because I separated from my mum. I was getting envelopes with cashing that I was living on, and I'm like, this sucks. Like, less than a year ago, I was an elite Royal Marines commando. I was walking around with my chest poked out with a green lid on my head, surrounded by elite men, doing elite stuff, traveling the world, and now I rent a room and live out of an envelope with a bit of cash in it, and it was just shit. And I thought, I know I'm way better than this. I know I am because 12 months ago I was living that way, and it's not, it's just a case of me kind of looking at that, reflecting that, and going, right, let's go back to the standards that I'm used to, that I know I can live to, and so I just like well, I'm not doing this crap anymore, and then just rejoined um and went back to pick up my career.

SPEAKER_04 36:16

Does is reflection something that you do often now then, Mark?

SPEAKER_03 36:20

No, I suck at it, and it's something I'm always working on to do more. You know, I I I could go out tomorrow and climb Mount Everest in my underwear, walking on one hand backwards with a bargain on, and everyone in the world can say this is amazing, I can't believe and I'd my mindset would be what's for dinner. Like I just suck at like like taking things in and then reflecting on them, like and just looking back and going, Oh, I'm quite proud of that. I just don't do it, and I think it's it's a negative but also a positive because a lot of people that I speak to that go on in life to achieve things that are similar, they don't and it's not dwelling, right? But they don't dwell on their accomplishments. They they they just go, we've done that, brilliant, I'm proud, next thing. Um, and I think that's the mindset that served me in rehab. I, you know, after this, I did six weeks in hospital, got to rehab, I'm like, okay, legs are gone, arms gone, that's done, next thing. Next thing's doing my lap, yeah, next thing seeks me in the water, and I just don't sit in things very long when I sometimes I should. Um, but now it's harder than ever because my pockets constantly vibrating and beeping, and kids are yanking at my t-shirt. Well, we need this, daddy, we need, and you don't have time. There's no time anymore.

SPEAKER_04 37:47

Yeah, yeah. I I I'm curious, what what habits do you have that keep you grounded through the the highs and lows of of of life, business, fatherhood? Is it is there any like go-tos that you build into your days and weeks?

SPEAKER_03 38:06

Yeah, I mean, I have I have structure, I'm a big fan of habits and routines um and discipline. So I get up every day now at five o'clock out of choice. I've done it for the last 15 years, maybe, when since my kids were born, uh, my other two, that that was the only time that I got to myself for some peace

Routines Discipline And Staying Grounded

SPEAKER_03 38:26

was like a little cup of coffee at five in the morning, sat in my bed, just like getting, and I loved it. And and I remember thinking, my life's gone from you know, what used to make me happy was going out with the lads, partying, buying a fast car. Now I just I want 15 minutes in the morning with a little cup of coffee, and that that's what made me happy. And I stuck to it because I like to get stuff done before while everyone's still asleep. So I I trained jujitsu, Brazilian jujitsu, at like six o'clock most mornings. That grounds you when you get the crap kicked out of you all the time by people. And no matter how good you think you're doing, someone will always subtly remind you that you're not as good as you think you are, and it and that humbles you. Um, and I have evening routines as well. Um, if I'm not doing Brazilian jujitsu, I do you know, I just lift weights, not for any particular reason, just to maintain my physique and keep my body healthy, and all that stuff keeps me grounded. I'm a fan of personal development, I like to uh always try to improve myself. I traveled the world a lot, so I listen to audiobooks, and then I'm always just trying to set and achieve goals, and that I feel gives me a purpose to get up in the morning and a bit of a drive. And you know, it's difficult. You know, just before we came on this podcast, I was just dripping to someone about business, and I'm just like, I feel like I'm headbutting a war sometimes. I'm like going around in circles, it never ends, it never stops. You sit and you look at your life in the military and you think, I can't believe I used to get Wednesday afternoon off for sport, and I could do go home at 12 o'clock on a Friday sometimes. Like, I I don't since leaving in 2010, I don't remember. I've I've never had a leave period. I've never gone like, oh, you're on two weeks Easter leave now. Never. I work most weekends, most nights till nine o'clock at night. I'm constantly doing something, trying to to build. Do you know what I mean? Because I don't want to, you know, we're very lucky. Like me and the lads, when we get injured, you get like a payout and uh a small monthly pension, so you can survive, like you don't technically have to work, but I was injured when I was 24 years old, and I'm not gonna sit on my ass for the next like 80 years of my life doing nothing, and I want to see what's possible, you know. Over the years, I've done the physical stuff, I've done the runs, the bike rides, got the gold medals, the world records, and all that kind of stuff, and that was wonderful, and it was stuff I was proud of, but it's very much within our our skill set of something physical, something mental. Um business, business is not my skill set because I'm a dummy. I got those 10 GCSEs I told you about, and that's it. More than me, mate. Oh, is it okay? Cool, I feel smart now. But I want to we we live in an age now where you have access to as much information as you want. AI's come in now, and that's just like blowing the whole world apart and changed the game completely. And what I'd love to do at some point is stand on a stage in front of however many entrepreneurs having really dominated this world. I'm not so money's not one of my like driving values. This is what I struggle with. I'm not bothered about earning tons of money to buy fancy things. I want to earn tons of money to show that I can do it, and I want to stand on a stage, and I've got it all planned out. The book is going to be called Four Fingers, One Thumb on a Smartphone, and it's about how a guy with three limbs missing made X amount of money and was successful because he just was trying to be smart and you know created businesses online and leveraged the internet and the seven billion people that have access to it. You know, if if one of each one of them people can give me a pound each, I'm laughing. You know what I mean? So it's a challenge, but we'll see.

SPEAKER_04 42:44

I'll post it later on, mate. Um one of them. Um so I I was gonna say then, does can discipline and routine become a trap?

SPEAKER_03 42:54

Sometimes, yeah, you've also got to kind of have that ability to not be too hard on yourself sometimes, you know.

SPEAKER_04 43:04

Sounds like you are though, mate.

SPEAKER_03 43:06

Yeah, I think so sometimes, but it's because I know what I want, and uh again, I think it's it's one of those character traits. I think a lot of people out there that are successful are hard on themselves, but I've slackened, you know, like this. This is gonna sound really stupid to some people listen to this. I was about to say I've slackened my routine a bit because on Sunday now I'll sleep until six, and that sounds stupid, but I'll give myself an extra hour on a Sunday as a as a little reward. Um but I'm also a big believer, like you you've got to keep moving, like physically and mentally, or you should just start rotting. And you know, being disabled is the perfect uh what's the word? I can't think of the word I'm trying to use to describe it, but you know, when you're disabled, if you're in a wheelchair, for example, and if you just sit in that wheelchair, you know, in that like L shape, or your organs start to get crushed because of gravity. But if you can, even if you got a standing frame and like once a day you got up and you were stood up straight, and you let your blood rush down to your feet, and you're gonna be a lot healthier for doing that. Even that's the best you can do in that scenario, then just do that. You just gotta keep your body and your mind moving, and business keeps my mind moving, stresses me. Out, but it keeps my mind moving. I try and you know, when it comes to stress, there's good stress and bad stress, right? I try and reframe it as good stress. It's just trying to make me think differently, to move differently, to act differently, to you know, overcome those obstacles by thinking it a different way rather than it's just gonna do my head in and just getting angry about it. I'm just always trying to take whatever scenario I'm in and learn from it and reframe it and turn it into a good thing, you know, rather than a bad thing. Yeah, that's what I do with my injuries, it's what I do do with everything.

SPEAKER_04 45:03

Yeah, I can't help but feel compelled to say this, mate, and that is there's there's a saying which I love and I often talk about um people who have heard me say it here before and write about, and it's something that comes up a lot with the clients I work with as well, but that we'll never get enough of what we don't need. Okay, and I I I'm curious, does anything come up for you when you hear that? You'll never get enough of what you don't need, and if he doesn't, that's fine, and because I've got an angle, what I that's something that I see, but we'll never get enough of what we don't need.

Success External Validation And What You Need

SPEAKER_01 45:42

Hmm, that's that's confused me a little bit.

SPEAKER_04 45:45

If we took it to an extreme, yeah, if we took it to as like alcohol, you'll never get enough alcohol because it's not actually what you need. So you'll we'll drink ourselves into oblivion, but it's not what we need. But potentially we're drinking to to feel alive or to to to numb something. Um, so achievements. I often see this in higher achievers, they they they go from constant heightened states, yeah, seeking the next thing, never pausing long enough to acknowledge, like like you've alluded to, of what they've got because they're always looking for the next thing, but it's not what they need. So they won't feel that that reward when they achieve it, because it's not what they need. I know on to the next thing. Yeah, so for me, it was external validation. I did stuff to be externally validated, but it never felt enough because it's not what I needed.

SPEAKER_03 46:35

So, how do you find out what you need then? Because what you're saying is is bang on me. Um I think that's why I kind of am the way I am, and I don't ever feel it doesn't matter what I do. I'm just like meh, okay, cool. I could, you know, I could literally now, if I wanted to, like open up one of my businesses online and it can make a million pounds in a day, and I'd just go, meh. I just I don't know, I don't know why. Exactly, exactly, because it's not what you need.

SPEAKER_04 47:05

I need to find out what I need or want. I don't know, there's no answer, mate. And that's a whole nother episode. That could be a life's work, by the way. And I don't think we always have to know, but for for me, it comes for me personally in my journey and story, it's a lot more internal, personal. So whether business is going really well or dog shit, it's it's separate from me. What can I be grateful for for where I am? And that's yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 47:33

Maybe I need to take a bit of time out. I usually do this a lot, like working on myself, and I haven't done it so much in the last couple of years, but maybe I do need to sit down and just like think, like get some breathing space and some head space, and think like what do I need? Because I I right now I certainly don't know.

SPEAKER_04 47:57

But yeah, I don't, I don't, it's not something that pops to us. Um, it's a constant experiment, little ones, yeah. And I know you're surrounded by some some good dudes, uh, one of them who's appeared here. Um, yeah. Mark, I'm I I could go on talking for hours, mate, but I'm aware that I said I would finish on the hour. Um, so I'm gonna keep to that. Um, but I'm curious if there's anything that I've not asked or that uh you would like to mention before we start to close out.

SPEAKER_03 48:29

Yeah, I this might I might get a bit like spiritual now.

SPEAKER_04 48:34

Love it. That's that's that's episode two, then, mate.

SPEAKER_03 48:36

But no, I was just gonna say, like, people ask me sometimes, like, what's like your your goal in life? And you know, I have a a bunch of goals, but my ultimate overriding goal is to become the ultimate version of myself. And what I love about that is that it's not achievable, and so it keeps you striving, you

Purpose Fun And Living To Potential

SPEAKER_03 49:00

know. I mean, I'm always just trying to be a little bit better, just one percent a day, and so that you know when I get to the end of my life, I can go, do you know what? I really like rinsed the life out of that and and did everything I could because that's what I think we're here for to like reach our full potential, and and but what you said is a bit that I feel like I'm I need to work on is like internally figuring out why. Because if I had to go to make a billion pounds, you know, why do I want to do that? Is it gonna make me happy? And if I get that and I feel miserable, what was the point? So I don't know, you know, I've spent a lot of time over the years doing this charity thing to try and help people, and that felt great. I haven't done that for a little while, so that there's something in that, like the reasons I was doing that that I could look into. But just for anyone listening, like I can I can tell you from personal experience, having died once, that life is short and it can end in a nanosecond, and it's when you least expect it. Like it doesn't, there's no, you know, for some of us, there are no warning signs, it just like in a nanosecond changes. So if you're feeling shit, you know, if you hate your job, if something's not going right in your life, get a grip of it. Like, set yourself some goals, give yourself some sort of purpose. Human beings, I think, are the happiest when they're striving towards a fulfilling goal or purpose. Just like forget all the the dog shit, you know. Like, oh, we've got to go on holiday, I've got to get a new BMW, I need a bigger house. Just focus on some shit that makes you happy and lights you up and what makes you want to get out of bed in the morning. And then if you're a better person internally, you kind of through osmosis make other people be better people, and then you know that that's kind of what I think it's all about. Do you know what I mean? Just live to your potential, do what lights you up and fulfills you, you know, discover what your purpose is, and then spend the rest of your days doing that.

SPEAKER_04 51:14

Two quick questions. Have you got two more minutes, Mark?

SPEAKER_03 51:17

Absolutely, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 51:18

Um, can I uh in fact I've got three questions. Have you got two more minutes? You've said yes. Um, can I ask you a coaching question? Yeah if you get stuck with this, that's absolutely fine. You don't have to answer it now when it comes to you. Drop me an answer. But I I'm curious, what if you already are the ultimate version of yourself today?

SPEAKER_03 51:42

That would be very sad because I'm only 42 and I don't plan on going anywhere until I'm at least 105. So what would I do for the rest of those days? Like what would I do? I have a great life. Like I said, I've got this cool routine. Get up every day, I do my fizz, do my work, self-development. No, I could do that. Um maybe travel a bit more. But no, I think there's there's way more juice in the tank yet. I don't have a black belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, I'm not a world champion yet. I haven't made a billion pounds yet.

SPEAKER_04 52:24

So we got stuff to do. I I I get that, and I think what's interesting is I hear you speak there, is yeah, the presence around, but today is enough. Tomorrow's another day. It doesn't mean we don't get to go again tomorrow.

SPEAKER_03 52:42

Yeah, no, you're right. Yeah. I think if there's one thing that I'm failing on massively in my life right now, it's having fun. I don't have enough fun anymore. I'm too I'm too kind of mission focused.

SPEAKER_04 53:06

Yeah, I I heard you, I heard, I heard you say service, and I heard you say fun. And I wonder what I wonder what you could create the service of fun. And again, you don't have to answer that, mate.

SPEAKER_03 53:18

But I was I'm filming a documentary right now with an ex-army guy, and on Tuesday we're up on Dartmoor, and it was me, a bunch of veterans, and a bunch of cameras, and we had a good time, and I literally said to the lads that this is what I want to do in my life. I want to hang around with good people, do good shit, and make money doing it. And I mean, imagine that, but all over the world, yeah, just traveling everywhere with a bunch of cool guys making cool content that you put on the internet, what inspires and motivates people, and you earn a living doing it. That's like the the ultimate, that's it. That's that's life for me. Awesome.

SPEAKER_04 53:57

Awesome. Lean into it then, mate. There's clues, there's clues there. Mark, listen, thank you so much for your time today. Sorry for boring yourself, boring by boring me, but that you weren't boring about telling your story again, although I'm not sorry. Um, but yeah, no, I appreciate who you're being, mate. I appreciate what you've created, the courage to to speak about what you do, um, and to be open and honest, mate. Um, yeah, who you are being is inspiring. So thank you from the bottom of my heart, and um, I'm gonna enjoy listening back to this. So cheers, pal.

SPEAKER_03 54:29

Thank you for having me.